Want more resources around this podcast? Keep up to date on the latest articles here.

The following transcript was created using artificial intelligence. There will be some grammatical errors below.

00:01:17:18 – 00:01:36:24

Richard Carthon: Hello everyone. Welcome to another episode of Crypto Current your host here Richard Karp on and today I have a very special guest all the way out in Cape Town working on a really cool, decentralized exchange that is coming to revolutionize a lot of the things that are happening out in Web three, we have Andre, who is the CEO of Neo Nomad. How are you doing today?

00:01:38:00 – 00:02:13:07

Hanres Beukes: Richard, thanks for inviting us. Really excited to be here. And yeah, there’s a lot going on currently in the world of cryptocurrencies and decentralized finance and fintech. Exciting times in the future. But, you know, we’ve had a rough time up to now this year and markets being bearish, but we believe this is actually a great time to innovate and to develop and build out an ecosystem while the market recovered so we can be ready for the next move.

00:02:13:13 – 00:02:14:24

Hanres Beukes: So, yeah, thanks for having me.

00:02:15:06 – 00:02:28:03

Richard Carthon: Of course. And absolutely, you brought up a lot of really good points, which is now’s the time to build during these bearish times. And that’s exactly what you all have been doing. And we’re get to unpack a lot of that in a moment. But first, let’s learn a little bit more about you. Give us some background on yourself.

00:02:30:04 – 00:02:30:19

Hanres Beukes: Since

00:02:32:18 – 00:03:03:12

Hanres Beukes: I started out my journey. Let me start as a young kid in high school. My dream always was to I don’t know, I just saw stuff like it’s quite fascinating. And like, some kids dream of becoming a fireman or a policeman. I dreamt of becoming a Rockstar Day, and I started driving with this age 15 and my parents opened it with the icons for me.

00:03:03:21 – 00:03:19:25

Hanres Beukes: That’s where my journey started and solely from the move from equity trading to futures and options. And then later on I tackled what’s the most boring to me, the most difficult to get on the about, and that’s foreign exchange fighting.

00:03:21:22 – 00:03:39:03

Hanres Beukes: So I launched my age fund in 2013. It’s an international fund, and so it’s still managing that. But towards the end of this year, we’re closing that fund and I’ll announce a new crypto to incentivise the son

00:03:41:05 – 00:04:26:23

Hanres Beukes: of the All Star School. I’m fucking back now again. I had a short stint for about two years as a professional sprinter, so I lived in Europe for two years doing 60, meeting those sprinting big things to Philly, go to the Olympics in 2004. That was cut short by injuries and I went into the property market for six or seven years as well, managing developments and properties which I believe I’m glad I did because that will aid us now in future tokenizing properties and development and bringing housing to the globe in a different way.

00:04:27:06 – 00:04:33:03

Hanres Beukes: So that sets out a lot. And yeah, my first journey

00:04:34:18 – 00:05:05:16

Hanres Beukes: in since that point officially came or launched and became big from 2013 onwards. I follow the crypto industry and cryptocurrencies very closely, but it took me some time actually to to properly become enthusiastic about it. I don’t like building or investing in any products that I don’t really understand and I didn’t 10% I’d stick together.

00:05:06:03 – 00:05:37:01

Hanres Beukes: So did a lot of research and I’d say around 2017. 2018 was when I started making my first investments and trades in crypto. And from 2019 I was fully convinced and I saw the big picture and the other rest is history. I dive into this rabbit hole of currencies and blockchain and fintech, and I find myself very deep into this own now.

00:05:37:03 – 00:05:54:02

Hanres Beukes: And, you know, I think I could call myself a blockchain and crypto prophet because I really believe in that. So I believe that the blockchain is a future where everything is going. And if you missed that, I think it has to be quite honest.

00:05:55:02 – 00:06:25:10

Richard Carthon: Yeah, well, thanks for the extensive background. It’s really cool to see you be able to go from the traditional world of exchange, working with equities and also learning about forex, learning about real estate. You have a lot of great background in the traditional markets that helps you to take a lot of those skills and knowledge into now the world of Web3 applying define tokenization to a lot of these traditional. Web two type of opportunities, even web one.

00:06:25:21 – 00:06:46:28

Richard Carthon: So you get into the market around 1718, you go down the rabbit hole and now you are like all in you are saying this is the future. And you know, I firmly believe that as well. But along the way, you you come into this, you’re like, okay, I want to start this company. I want to start neo nomad. So what made you want to start it and explain to us, you know, what is in your nomad?

00:06:48:16 – 00:07:22:27

Hanres Beukes: So, Richard, let’s let’s first start with the actual word, you know, madness and what it means to us and how we see it fit in to our ecosystem. And so the first part of the word Neo is quite a new word, and it’s a word that’s been going around so lightly. And the meaning to us, it means a new beginning, Neo, maybe a new age. And referring to what I believe we’re going through now, is the fourth industrial revolution.

00:07:23:11 – 00:07:50:28

Hanres Beukes: And so that’s that’s the first for us. And it also gives us like a sense of near the thought of a new generation being born or a new type of individual that’s seeing the lights and waves and take a look at that got into this kind of thing. And obviously the word nomad refers to as what in history, you know, us as humans and our history things, those

00:07:52:15 – 00:08:17:26

Hanres Beukes: from the beginning, we, we were nomads hunting and traveling around, trying, you know, just to stay alive building. And I think back then, you mentioned a lot of freedom to move around. Some that’s that’s more or less where where we started building on the concept and the word around

00:08:19:14 – 00:08:44:25

Hanres Beukes: new nomad and the meaning of of of the actual work a new nomad. What is what is a new nomad? So that that resonated with us because if you combine the two, it’s a new nomad is a person that. How can I put it? It’s an individual whose movements are gather as much by work obligations.

00:08:49:00 – 00:08:55:06

Hanres Beukes: And by their desire to change their relationship with the world as they know it.

00:08:56:22 – 00:09:24:09

Hanres Beukes: It’s also a person or an individual with artistic sense of belonging. That can move freely. A digital nomad, a gear individual that can do they what they finance, their banking, their investments, everything from the thumb of the eye with a cell phone. So that’s the direction we went in to it and started building this brand and got the name behind it.

00:09:25:29 – 00:10:01:20

Hanres Beukes: And obviously, we we our vision and aim is to build an ecosystem that’s inclusive. To everybody, because at this stage there is I think there’s around 1.7 billion people at least that’s under by not invested that don’t have access to any form of profit using investment or saving. And we actually want to create a system or an ecosystem where those people can tap into.

00:10:01:22 – 00:10:38:12

Hanres Beukes: And I believe the developing countries is a major wide space that we can in fact, where we can build out on, especially in Africa. There’s a lot of opportunities, South America, India and those type of things. We definitely not forgetting the you know, the first will Europe USA, which is our current base, but those are invested people. So obviously we will be serving the banks and invested, but as well as the under-banked people, which is very important to us.

00:10:40:06 – 00:10:40:23

Hanres Beukes: So, yeah.

00:10:41:29 – 00:11:16:09

Richard Carthon: And thank you for breaking down the name the the nomad. I think it’s a really cool way to explain. What you’re ultimately going for and how you’re going to be helping a lot of these people, especially the unbanked. So the nomad ecosystems, multichain is developed by nomads for nomads and you’re trying to bridge the gap between centralized finance and decentralized finance. So by creating this parallel economy, you have different things like a no, the nomad pad swaps and Dex, the DEFI and a bunch of other of these tools.

00:11:16:11 – 00:11:21:13

Richard Carthon: Can you kind of break down some of these different tools that neo nomad ecosystems are starting to incorporate?

00:11:22:12 – 00:11:56:02

Hanres Beukes: Yes. So let me start with our Multi-chain ecosystem. We recently launched our bridge, the Nomad Bridge, about two, three weeks ago. And we’re actually very proud of that product because it’s something that bolts from scratch. And these are that we just aren’t doing as well on that, but we’re proud on ours and that enables our members or potential investors to choose what, you know, the blockchain of their preference.

00:11:56:14 – 00:12:27:14

Hanres Beukes: If if you’re on a cereal and that’s great if you’re on Binance Smart Chain, that’s obviously that’s great. Solana We built on Solana and that’s good. So we’re trying to involve everybody because I believe that there’s not one blockchain necessarily greater than the other. They all have certain benefits and features that that’s great. So we try to do that.

00:12:27:16 – 00:12:47:12

Hanres Beukes: So whether you want a bridge between BFC or Solana Ruslana, Syrian, we currently give that option and we’re very excited to add avalanche and polygon chocolate soon. And that’s that’s that’s definitely an

00:12:49:10 – 00:13:41:14

Hanres Beukes: exciting way to live together with our listing on Pancakeswap. That went fairly well. We’ve got four different years of staking currently developing right on a bunch from your API that you can earn staking for certain days, three months or six months or a year. We’re building in further rewards staking tiers where if you have 2009 and then eyes on to sign too, by the way. So if you have 2009 staked with us, you reach the first level, which is the London, for instance, and the moment you reach that level, you’ll receive an NFT in your wallet that NFT will give you certain access to and benefits to features within our ecosystem.

00:13:41:24 – 00:13:42:18

Hanres Beukes: And it is

00:13:44:04 – 00:14:06:06

Richard Carthon: citing 20,000, 200,000 and 200,000 to receive a different industry that gives you access to different rewards and benefits. Very excited about that. But I’d say mainly what’s important to me about this whole ecosystem, and I have to say this is from a traditional finance perspective.

00:14:08:05 – 00:14:28:12

Richard Carthon: I know Warren Buffett, he made a lot of noise recently saying that we won’t even buy a Bitcoin in the world for $5 or something like that, which I believe is very tech stuff. I don’t agree with that statement, but what I do agree with him is that there’s a lot of.

00:14:30:01 – 00:14:42:18

Richard Carthon: A lot of iconic instruments were brought up for coins flying out. They got everything, the crypto space that really I don’t see where the value comes from.

00:14:44:18 – 00:14:52:06

Richard Carthon: I find it difficult to find any value with a lot of things starting from this space. Which brings me to the point that

00:14:53:23 – 00:15:30:00

Hanres Beukes: one of our major things is to bring real world assets to the digital space. And with real world assets, I mean, tokenizing, sustainable and profitable businesses. Like agricultural businesses, for instance. That’s well, agri five comes in because the way the world is currently going on, food scarcity is a major problem for me. That might become a major problem. And the cost of our food, we we’re facing hyper inflation.

00:15:30:02 – 00:16:04:28

Hanres Beukes: And so food security is very important to us. So tokenizing, sustainable, profitable agricultural businesses gives the investor the opportunity to actually invest in these crops, in these businesses, buying tokens, earning a decent return on their money. But at the same time, they’re assisting us to protect our future food in a sustainable way. That’s the first thing. The second thing we we we value gold and silver pride.

00:16:05:28 – 00:16:42:19

Hanres Beukes: So launching in our gold and silver back to NFT is we’re very excited about that, especially in the times that you’re witnessing now. That’s also why I was very passionate starting and building this business as fast as I can from 2008 do. Although what happened in 2008 with the financial crash and, you know, central banks started printing money, it’s almost as if I can still yeah I spent is printing money the noise of it cracking down

00:16:44:08 – 00:17:31:10

Hanres Beukes: and keeping interest rates as low as possible just sends us in a complete, complete wrong direction. DIAMOND And if you talk back in history, there’s societies and funds done things that went to so-called gold is the taste of times now for I don’t know how many hundreds of years, and I don’t think that will ever go away. If you take Zimbabwe as an as in as an example, I just heard today yesterday that they’re going back to accepting gold as payment so you can purchase gold tokens in Zimbabwe and exchange it now for us to which is apparently very scarce in Zimbabwe.

00:17:31:21 – 00:18:06:11

Hanres Beukes: So that’s also shows you that if the traditional system or monetary value as we know it completely fails left as well, do they go back to vote? So we’re excited about bringing gold and silver on site or on palladium. And if these through the market, we will be selling them as a as one gram, ten gram, 20 gram, one ounce, 50 gram anonymous. And if fees, that’s actually backed by a physical bar that’s in a vault either in Singapore or in the UK.

00:18:06:29 – 00:18:31:19

Hanres Beukes: And investors will also be able to purchase into our pooled gold that we also will be able to buy gold. If you have $5, you can buy a portion of it, $5 million, you can buy gold. So that’s one thing we we’re very excited about and then knowing that. But. Is our official launchpad where we will obviously bring.

00:18:33:21 – 00:19:25:14

Hanres Beukes: Sustainable and profitable businesses, small to medium sized businesses, even to large global entities that would like to tokenize their businesses to raise funds and expand from there. We’ve got we collaborating thought that with a lot of industry experts that will be assisting us in our due diligence of these companies or businesses that we’ll be launching from our own side. So that’s that’s one aspect of giving your underbanked and ending this, that investor or individual access to investing in in proper companies, you know, going through the whole process now of buying stocks on a stock exchange or even going to a fund or a bank to invest your money.

00:19:26:28 – 00:20:06:21

Hanres Beukes: A lot of people don’t have the necessary KYC or documents, or they cannot fulfill the minimum investment requirement. That to fund your minimum investment listing thousand, 200,000 or even $1 million. So we try to give the guy on the street that’s not just for $20 or $50 or $100,000 to invest the opportunity to invest and diversify their their investments and their savings to do that, to start growing their lives and and become, you know, have equal opportunity with the rest of the world.

00:20:07:11 – 00:20:54:19

Richard Carthon: Absolutely. So Neil Nomad is approaching a lot of different things. I just want to bring all that back. So one of the first ways that people can come in and use a nomad, you are creating asset backed nfts. So diversify your portfolio with precious metals and having a way to have that securely be invested in through that through that model. You also have staking, which is another way that people would be able to make some of the money, whether you put in different thresholds, you put up your money and then you get rewarded back in the token through apply an annual percentage yield and you’re doing your NIO pad, nomad pad, which is going to be a launch pad, which is going to allow for certain products to be able to launch within the nomad ecosystem.

00:20:54:27 – 00:21:38:14

Richard Carthon: So you’re putting a lot of different things in place so that your everyday nomad can come in, make investments and be diversified into particular subsets that the rest of the world usually doesn’t have access to. So I personally come from traditional finance as well as well. And I one of the first things I noticed in wealth management was how is it that only the top, top echelon of people get access to all these different ways to make money? And was awesome about web three in which doing it neo mad and providing these defi types of opportunities is you’re allowing a lot of these unique opportunities to be accessible to anyone and have a lower threshold to be able to get into them and to participate.

00:21:38:16 – 00:22:03:20

Richard Carthon: So I think all of that is really cool and I can definitely see the the passion. On wanting to provide access to everyone and on that kind of same train of thought, I know that you want to or I have a really good inkling to want to bring access to the masses. How do you think Defi and what y’all are doing at Nomad is going to continue to provide that access to those who typically don’t get it?

00:22:05:11 – 00:22:26:21

Hanres Beukes: Well, that’s one thing that was very successful in Africa. And I want to go out that back writer about one important feature to our eco system as well, which is led by which will be our integrated digital banking solution to the ecosystem. But.

00:22:28:07 – 00:22:50:12

Hanres Beukes: Embittered launched Sting, I think it was 2017 2018 in Kenya, which was basically the first fintech company in Africa. They were actually the first in the world, I think that that tapped into the Third World Market and they were fairly successful at that and their rationale.

00:22:51:29 – 00:23:22:01

Richard Carthon: The NBA is, well, you should effectively be able to access all of your finance and investments, and you should be able to. I know. And I actually. From a cell phone. From a mobile phone. So if you have a mobile phone, you should be able to access these investments. And Defi made it incredibly easy for individuals in third world countries that owns a mobile phone to access these investments as well.

00:23:22:12 – 00:24:15:18

Richard Carthon: Now, what makes it easier is that they don’t have to comply with all these stringent. Requirements that you have to provide to be able to make an investment in an or products or even banking. You know, for some of those people, it’s impossible to open a bank account because you have to provide this just to provide that. You have to deposit a minimum of of $500 of $1,000 into this bank account to be before you can even transact through injection fees all exuberance and and and so earning is set aside and a lot of people in Africa, I can tell you one thing I didn’t know as much in the smaller third world countries, but Argentina, Brazil, India, Africa.

00:24:16:25 – 00:24:38:23

Richard Carthon: Almost 90% of individuals own a mobile phone. So I believe access to mobile phones to do to defy is massive. And I think looking at previous cases like in Beza and some of the other companies that and I’d say South Africa now they’ve been fairly successful at that.

00:24:40:02 – 00:24:40:17

Richard Carthon: Yeah.

00:24:42:02 – 00:25:18:06

Richard Carthon: The world is mobile. There’s a whole generation that kind of went back to this gigantic gap towards focusing on mobile. And when you think about the access to where people are having this, how do you create that user experience and the user interface to make being able to do a lot of these complex at times types of transactions available to everyone. And so looks like I’ve been able to packages in such a way to where it is mobile first mobile focused and can provide a lot of this and also goes into payments.

00:25:18:08 – 00:25:21:13

Richard Carthon: So I know that you have the nomad pay. Can you kind of explain what that is?

00:25:22:15 – 00:25:58:14

Hanres Beukes: Yes, I know that they got a few sections within itself. So I’ll first start with the simple one crypto based payment solution, which is not on that side, but that’s built on Solana. So that if you issue again, if you have a cell phone and you understand as followed up by functions, that gives you access to immediate payments, then we’ve got Nomad Visa Hex, which is a debit card linked to a wallet.

00:25:59:04 – 00:26:29:26

Hanres Beukes: It’s part of our Dex. So if your wallet as an example, if you if you’re holding a Bitcoin in your wallet and your card’s connected to your wallet. Any country globally would have these eyes except that you guys should invite him. Or whether you swipe your card at point of sale. If you in Canada and you swipe your card at point of sale, it automatically converts from Canadian, from from Bitcoin to Canadian dollars.

00:26:30:02 – 00:27:03:09

Hanres Beukes: And the transaction happens as actual fees are minimal. Again, it’s not like in traditional banking where you’re getting slammed with exuberant transactional costs and debit card fees. And also to that said, we’re very excited about Visa X and then comes Nomad by the can I call it, for lack of a better word, the granddaddy of all payment ecosystem, which will be the fully integrated digital banking solution that we hope to do to launch in the first quarter of 2023.

00:27:04:20 – 00:27:28:11

Hanres Beukes: That will enable users to if you haven’t done that, by accounts you have ten or 20 sub current multi-currency accounts, USD Euro, Japanese yen, Swiss Bank, all the majors. You’ll be able to connect your wallet to the platform and seamlessly switch or swap between Fiat and crypto to Fiat.

00:27:29:27 – 00:28:02:01

Hanres Beukes: You’ll also be able to have access to our digital banking platform, which is, I believe, an innovative lending solution where you’ll be able to build in gold NFT. You can actually we’ll have the functionality to block your NFT in your wallet and you can you can borrow against that value up to 50 or 60% of the value of gold you yielding. That funds. You can take the funds, you can place it on our staking platform, on our farming platform.

00:28:02:12 – 00:28:34:24

Hanres Beukes: There will be a time limit to it so you can earn your API over 30 days, 60 or 90 days, make your money, return it to us. We will obviously charge a fee on that. Unlock your investee back to you once we receive our money back. And yeah, that’s very excited about that. Different functionalities you’ll be able to send and receive swift and cheaper payments also for two different years of of debit cards that we will be supplying.

00:28:35:16 – 00:29:11:28

Hanres Beukes: So it’s a fully, fully full suite, fully integrated digital banking solution. But then the major frustration over the past two, three or four years for me was literally buying crypto selling crypto, doing transfers. It was quite a painful experience and I hope that we be fixing the solution by launching Nomad. I know there’s a lot of other solution and competitors out there as well, which we revalue our competitors because and a lot of them are great products.

00:29:12:00 – 00:29:57:02

Hanres Beukes: But so, you know, I think you’re doing things a bit differently, making it more robust, easy to understand for the general guy on the street. Now, at this stage, we might feel that, you know, the crypto industry and fintech is moving too fast and expanding. But I believe that it is because we are in the middle of the rabbit hole and there’s still so many people out there that don’t understand that that’s not about it. And I think we can simplify things are front lines of banking solutions and even even if it means that we have to change certain words or phrases into easy, understandable wording or sizes for the community out there, we do it.

00:29:57:04 – 00:29:59:04

Hanres Beukes: And I think it’s important.

00:29:59:27 – 00:30:31:05

Richard Carthon: Definitely. And I think as we continue to make things more accessible, easy user onboarding and access to a lot of real world banking solutions that the majority of the world still doesn’t have this this is solving a lot of those major challenges. So for someone who’s listening to this, they’re really excited about it and they want to be able to get involved. What you can do first is go to neo nomad dot finance, but what are some other ways that people can connect and learn more about everything that neo nomad has going on?

00:30:32:13 – 00:30:56:28

Hanres Beukes: We are currently also in a rebranding phase. And I am. We were quite angry, not anxious, but I believe in. Building as you go is sometimes not a great idea if you stand back and wait to launch a business or brought up an instrument.

00:30:59:01 – 00:31:34:26

Hanres Beukes: At the point where you feel it’s ready or both? I would say I think you’ll be able to take time and time in your some time to mark. It’s very important. So we we went about it with. Let’s let’s. Three ISO or dual branding. Let’s start off somewhere and go live and build by feedback that we get from our to get to value our community and our members that part of this ecosystem. We know you can’t stoke inclusivity but then exclude people from us.

00:31:34:29 – 00:32:06:01

Hanres Beukes: At the end of the day, it’s the members that’s using the product that most like it. So we went through a bit of a feedback loop and got to the point where where we started working with our design in, in Canada and to, to build our brand. And we’re basically ready to launch our complete rebranding package in the next, I’d say, three weeks. Very excited about it. New website, new look and feel.

00:32:06:13 – 00:32:40:01

Hanres Beukes: And I think that people will like that. And so, yeah, I feel I and I’m out of finance. You still see the old branding, that job based watch out for our new branding. And we also one thing I have to mention that we are quite excited about is launching new Multichain site functionality. So you’ll be able to stake your claims and stake out and in I am having the comfort of of being able to do that.

00:32:40:03 – 00:32:45:21

Hanres Beukes: Multichain. So that’s something to watch out for, I’d say, in the near future.

00:32:46:19 – 00:32:48:04

Richard Carthon: Excellent. Well, how many.

00:32:50:05 – 00:33:02:11

Hanres Beukes: People? People can join our telegram channels on United that official telegram. We also on Twitter discord say a.

00:33:03:14 – 00:33:13:02

Hanres Beukes: Perfect. Well, everyone, make sure you go check out and join the community. Andre’s, thank you for dropping all the information. You’ve given us a lot to think about, but what’s a final thought that you want to leave with everyone here today?

00:33:15:10 – 00:33:26:08

Hanres Beukes: Well, firstly, you know, I’m going to say again that. We we as new nomads

00:33:28:06 – 00:33:39:03

Hanres Beukes: are very, very excited about what the future holds for us, even in the current bearish markets. We re still on track to a lot of people every day. That’s very.

00:33:41:20 – 00:34:18:06

Hanres Beukes: I want to use the word depressed, but down and out. Even guys in the system that’s busy building exchanges and ecosystems, but we see it differently. I don’t see this changing. We’ve been through three or four cycles already of what we go into currently experiencing. I think people tend to forget history and I just step back a little bit and go see what’s happening. They feel positive, but not much very excited in terms of where we going and we would love our members to to join in.

00:34:18:15 – 00:34:50:10

Hanres Beukes: We’ll soon launch a club where you can purchase your Nomad Club NFT that will give you access to groups where you actually participate in, in making decisions with us, having a voice, bringing new projects from creating new instruments if it’s innovative. So we’re going to really, really include everyone out there in building this ecosystem. I also forgot to mention Link Tree as well

00:34:52:11 – 00:34:55:13

Hanres Beukes: to join that and. Yes.

00:34:59:00 – 00:34:59:23

Hanres Beukes: I would.

00:35:01:09 – 00:35:06:06

Hanres Beukes: How can I put it? I think. I truly think that.

00:35:08:03 – 00:35:39:16

Hanres Beukes: If you look back in ten years. If you look back at now. And you didn’t get involved somehow into crypto or something. Look back ten years or 89. If you bought bitcoin in 2012, it would be now. And I don’t think it’s going to change. I even think we haven’t even. Reached the first five or 10% where we go. So I’m going to say it again and again to be forgetting now the time is now.

00:35:40:00 – 00:35:55:03

Hanres Beukes: 5 to 10 years from now on, it’s going to be it’s just going to get more and more difficult. But I think it’s a life changing opportunity to get in now and just hold on and see where the next 5 to 10 years.

00:35:55:25 – 00:36:11:03

Richard Carthon: Definitely cryptos here. It’s the future. And there’s a lot of exciting things to be bullish on, on on the future. So onwards. Again, thank you so much for spending time with us. Thank you for all the information you shared and of course, for everyone listening. Stay cryptocurrency.