The following transcript was created using artificial intelligence. There will be some grammatical errors below. 

00:00:05:05 – 00:00:18:27

Richard Carthon: Hello, everyone. Welcome to another episode of Crypto Current, your host, Richard Carthon and today I have a very special guest working on a really cool project that you might have already heard of. We have Dr. Leemon Baird with Hedera hashgraph. How are you doing today? 

00:00:19:25 – 00:00:21:18

Dr. Leemon Baird: Doing well. It’s good to be here with you, 

00:00:22:05 – 00:00:36:20

Richard Carthon: Of course, man. Well, there’s a lot that y’all are currently working on that I want to go and unpack. Plenty of things from auctions to commerce to a ton of transactions that’s going on, but before we dive into all of that, let’s learn a little bit more about you. Can you give us some background on yourself? 

00:00:37:20 – 00:00:54:26

Dr. Leemon Baird: Sure, so I’ve done lots of different things. I was a professor, I was a scientist in a bunch of labs, I’ve been an entrepreneur for 20 years and started a bunch of companies, just all sorts of things, you know? I like computer science and math. And what I’m doing right now is Hedera, which is building a whole company to be distributed ledger.

00:00:54:28 – 00:01:00:28

Richard Carthon: Which is incredible. What was your first introduction into the Crypto, Blockchain space? Like, how do you first learn about it? 

00:01:01:23 – 00:01:19:18

Dr. Leemon Baird: Well, like everybody, I just read papers about it and heard about it. But the funny thing is, I wasn’t really interested in that. I was interested in a math problem, how to get computers to work in a way that wasn’t being done. It really had nothing to do with the Blockchain world. But when I solved the math problem, I realized Ooh, that’s a really good ledger, and so we started a company for it. 

00:01:20:07 – 00:01:32:27

Richard Carthon: Right. Which is pretty incredible, man. So, like, all right, let’s talk through that. So, what year was it when you’re starting to solve these really hard math problems and you’re like, Alright, I’m going to build this company to help solve these particular challenges that I’m seeing? 

00:01:33:27 – 00:02:02:11

Dr. Leemon Baird: Yeah. So, the math problem in 2012, I was working on this, could you get computers to make an agreement that’s really, really secure but also really, really fast. And, you know, I played with it and I convinced myself, Nah, it’s not really possible and I set it aside. And then, a little while later it’d come back and haunt me again and I’d pick it up and play with it again, work on it for a few days and say, No, it really is impossible inside of the site. I have lots of math problems I do that with. I’ve been working on them for decades on some problems and I’ll never solve them. But they’re just fun. I do it for fun. 

00:02:03:00 – 00:02:03:15

Richard Carthon: Gotcha. 

00:02:03:17 – 00:02:49:02

Dr. Leemon Baird: However, this one just wouldn’t go away, like many problems. But in 2015, I realized, you know, if we just talk to each other in the simplest way possible by gossip, just randomly talking to random computers, and every time you give a message you just attach two little tiny hashes of the last message you received in the last one you created. You automatically for free, if everybody knowing the entire history of how information flowed through your network, which means you could do consensus with zero communication, you just gossip about these messages with the two hashes and then with no further talking at all, you could get the absolute highest level of security, asynchronous Byzantine folk tolerance. And that was cool in 2015. So, you know, it solved the math problem. 

00:02:49:04 – 00:03:33:15

Dr. Leemon Baird: You can be both secure and fast at the same time. I was pretty sure it was impossible, but eventually figured out, Oh, just add two hashes and you’re done. That was easy. So, we then said Mance Harmon has started a bunch of companies with me and we decided we would build a company to build a distributed ledger on that. First we did a private ledger in 2016 and in the summer of 2016 we said, ‘Wow, this is catching on so well, we should do a public ledger.” And that’s Hedera. It was incorporated in 2017. We announced it to the world in 2018 and launched our network. We created the 50 billion H bars. They’ll never be any more Cryptocurrency. It’s a fixed supply. In 2019, we opened it up to the world and then the last year and a half it’s just exploded. 

00:03:34:02 – 00:03:34:17

Richard Carthon: Yeah.

00:03:34:19 – 00:03:37:09

Dr. Leemon Baird: The number of transactions boggles my mind. It’s just amazing.

00:03:37:11 – 00:04:00:12

Richard Carthon: No, let’s spend some time there. I mean, first of all, it’s really cool that the passion for you and you can just hear the passion in your voice is like, it comes from solving really complex problems. But you were first able to create that and you’re like, Wow, I can now bring this to the world, like, and continue to build upon that. So, you create Hedera hashgraph and now speed up. I believe you said it’s done over a billion transactions recently. Can you talk about that a little bit?

00:04:01:05 – 00:04:22:16

Dr. Leemon Baird: Yeah. Can you believe that? I think we’re over 1.3 billion transactions now. And these aren’t test transactions, these are real transactions from real users who are building real things on top of us that solve real business problems. One point three billion transactions have been processed. And, you know, Ethereum and it’s whole history has done less than that. One point one something, I think. 

00:04:22:28 – 00:04:23:13

Richard Csrthon: Right. 

00:04:23:15 – 00:04:42:16

Dr. Leemon Baird: But we did it in a year and a half. And so, we are the most used ledger on the planet right now. And the funny thing is that we’re going really fast in number of transactions each second, but it’s getting faster and it’s rapidly going up. And we can go, well, right now, we’ve slowed it down to a mere 10,000 transactions a second. We could actually handle 10,000 transactions a second on our current network. 

00:04:42:26 – 00:04:43:11

Richard Carthon: Wow.

00:04:43:13 – 00:04:56:07

Dr. Leemon Baird: But that’s an artificial slowdown. We’ll go even faster in the future. And so, we could handle billions a month without breaking a sweat or many billions a month without breaking a sweat. And I think we’re going to get there. It looks like we’re going to get there someday. 

00:04:56:21 – 00:05:31:12

Richard Carthon: And there’s two things that I think really need to, like, go back and spend some time on, One, the fact you’ve already done more transactions than Ethereum in significantly less amount of time is, you know, extremely noteworthy. But then the speed at which that happens as well. As we all know, Ethereum gas is a real challenge and problem right now. And one of the things that I know that Hedera is doing to help solve that is being able to do all this speed. You have a couple of different ways that you’re tackling that. I believe one of them is through your Hedera consensus service. Can you kind of talk through that a little bit?

00:05:32:08 – 00:05:52:15

Dr. Leemon Baird: Yeah. So, we have a fast network. If you want to transfer Cryptocurrency, it’s really fast. If you want to mint a token and then transfer those tokens, it’s really fast. You don’t have to use an ERC 20 smart contract, you can do it at native layer. We have tokens at the native layer. We also have ERC 20 contracts and we have smart contracts. You can do solidity contracts.

00:05:52:17 – 00:05:53:02

Richard Carthon: Right.

00:05:53:04 – 00:06:34:11

Dr. Leemon Baird: But at the native layer, you can do tokens without having to use a smart contract, which makes them much, much faster. In addition to that though, over time we’ll probably cram even more things in a native layer. But we don’t really have to because we have the consensus service, which means anyone in the world can build at the native layer on Hedera. And so, you can build an app net, your own computers, your own network, it could even be an Ethereum network or a hyper larger fabric network or Q3, whatever you want to do. You can do your own network and at the bottom, have Hedera be the consensus for it. 

00:06:34:15 – 00:07:05:27

Dr. Leemon Baird: And then you get all of the trust of Hedera and all the speed of a native layer transaction of native layer network. And it just runs at the native air speed. We put all the transactions in order and put timestamps on them and you do all the processing. And if you wanted to, you can even encrypt everything and keep it all super secret and super private. It would really be a private network, but with the trust of a public network. So, I’m excited about the consensus service that lets you do that. And if you don’t want to do all that, use the token service. You can do tokens at the native layer speed and you can do Cryptocurrency at the token layer speed and other things. 

00:07:06:10 – 00:07:39:11

Richard Carthon: Right. No, man, that’s extremely exciting. And the fact that you can go from not having to do is like an ERC 20, although you can, it’s really at the native level, shows the speed and it shows the ease of use of using your platform. And one of the things where I think this has a lot of utility is potentially in the retail space and just like, different areas in different ways that businesses would be able to use Hedera to build on top of that platform. Can you kind of speak to the different ways that you’re seeing use cases for Hedera right now? 

00:07:40:06 – 00:07:59:11

Dr. Leemon Baird: Yeah. So, we mentioned it was fast, but the flip side of fast is that each transaction can be very, very cheap. If you’re doing lots per second, you can afford to make them very cheap. And so, you don’t have to pay $30 for a transaction or $1 for a transaction, you pay a tenth of a penny for a transaction. Some transactions are a hundredth of a penny.

00:07:59:13 – 00:07:59:28

Richard Carthon: Wow.

00:08:00:00 – 00:08:27:16

Dr. Leemon Baird: Of US dollars, ten thousandth of a US dollar. So, you pay very, very small amounts, which means this is great for business applications, real world applications, where you really do have to worry about things like the cost and the cost is in US dollars. You pay H bars for your transactions, of course, the Cryptocurrency, but the cost is denominated in dollars. And so, as the price of H bar goes up and down, the cost is predictable. You know what you’re going to be paying. 

00:08:27:26 – 00:08:48:11

Dr. Leemon Baird: And so, we have people building all kinds of things on us. I can give you an example. Spencer Dinwiddie has built Calaxy, the Creators Galaxy, which is NFTs that allow you to monetize. Creators can monetize all sorts of things that have never had a market before, including weird things like your own future income or the shoes you wore at the latest game.

00:08:48:13 – 00:08:49:02

Richard Carthon: Right.

00:08:49:04 – 00:08:56:00

Dr. Leemon Baird: Or time. I’m sure someone would pay a million dollars to have a half hour lunch with you. You can monetize that using Calaxy.

00:08:56:02 – 00:08:56:27

Richard Carthon: Right.

00:08:56:29 – 00:09:05:05

Dr. Leemon Baird: So, you can do that kind of thing with Calaxy. And they’re doing it based on NFTs, based on building on our token service on Hedera.

00:09:05:07 – 00:09:40:02

Richard Carthon: Which is absolutely incredible. And for those, when you heard the name, so, he actually plays for the Brooklyn Nets right now and it’s really working on a really cool project. Calaxy, definitely go check that out. We’ll put that in the show notes as well. But I mean, the use cases are incredible. The fact that people can be as creative as that and to build on it just speaks to the volumes. But the other thing that I think is really cool about Hedera right now is what y’all are doing in the NFT space and even trying to, like, give back some of all the good that you’re doing. And I know right now you’re working on an auction, can you kind of speak to that a little bit? 

00:09:40:26 – 00:10:13:06

Dr. Leemon Baird: Yeah, yeah. We should talk about this and Hopeful Solutions. So, we are going to do an auction for charity on Hedera using auction code that we’ve written and we’re releasing open source, so anyone can do auctions the same way, using NFTs on us. And we’re going to do it for these metal coins that I made in 2018. They have the Hedera H on them. There’s a gold colored one and a silver colored one and you can also go to our store and buy them. And we have them made at Shapeways, 3D printer printer service. 

00:10:13:08 – 00:10:43:11

Dr. Leemon Baird: But if you want to get the two original ones that I made, I only made two and I stamped them with serial numbers myself, which is why they look terrible, because I know nothing about how to stamp things. Turns out it’s really hard. But I stamped them with serial numbers, I made a certificate of authenticity, took a picture of the certificate of authenticity and the hash of that is now in an NFT token. There’s two tokens, one for the gold one, one for the silver one. There’s the color is not what they’re made of. 

00:10:44:18 – 00:10:45:03

Richard Carthon: Right.

00:10:45:06 – 00:11:13:13

Dr. Leemon Baird: And then we’re going to have an auction for charity. And so, people can bid. You can bid whatever you want. The auction will be automated. We’re setting up a network using our software of people that you can trust, external peoplem they’ll run this auction. At the endm the winners will get the metal coin and the piece of paper and the NFT. And so, we’re auctioning off an NFT. Now you may have heard of someone paying $69,000 for NFT of a gift that was just a picture that wasn’t in any physical object.

00:11:13:15 – 00:11:14:08

Richard Carthon: Right.

00:11:14:10 – 00:11:17:16

Dr. Leemon Baird: We’re during the NFT, but we’re also doing a physical object. So, you get both. 

00:11:18:04 – 00:11:18:19

Richard Carthon: Right.

00:11:18:21 – 00:11:46:00

Dr. Leemon Baird: The focus of this has to be as a demonstration, but we’re going to raise money. I don’t know how much we’re going to raise, but whatever we raise, we’re going to get to Hopeful Solutions, which is a charity for homeless mothers in Dallas. And I can’t even imagine what it would be like to live on the streets as a homeless mother, especially in the winter. Anyway, it’s a cool charity. And Hopeful Solutions is this charity in Dallas. We’re going to give all the proceeds from this auction to that. 

00:11:46:06 – 00:12:14:23

Dr. Leemon Baird: The two coins, I personally donated to Hedera for free and now Hedera is going to auction and to give all the money to the charity. I think that’s really cool. And I just think it’s going to be a great demonstration of how you can do auctions using Hedera and also, you know, NFTs are the future. And this is just one more playful way of showing that they’re the future. But I think a lot of big businesses, including some of our own council members, are now building real things on NFTs, like Calaxy is doing.

00:12:14:25 – 00:12:15:10

Richard Carthon: Right.

00:12:15:12 – 00:12:16:19

Dr. Leemon Baird: And DLA Piper and others. 

00:12:17:12 – 00:12:54:09

Richard Carthon: Yeah. And there’s a couple of great things I want to unpack in that. One, the fact that you are taking the proceeds and immediately giving them to the homeless shelter. Homeless woman of Dallas, awesome, really incredible. But then the other part of it, too, and there’s a kind of a reoccurring thing that’s happened in Hedera is that you built these use cases and then you actually do them in real time, show them, Hey, we’re doing this, you can do this, too. And as you know, for some people, they just need to hear that spark of like, Oh, that’s possible. And, Oh, this is a platform I can possibly do that on and like, Oh, but have you considered X, Y, Z? And now, of course, now their wheels are turning. Now they’re like, Okay, I can go do this thing. 

00:12:54:17 – 00:13:23:05

Richard Carthon: I think that’s really, really unique and pretty awesome about Hedera. And you know, thank you for already breaking down a bunch of different things that Hedera’s able to do. But something else that I kind of want to pose up to you is just, what else is on the roadmap, right? So, of course, being in innovation, constantly innovating and building more amazing things and making Hedera the place, an ideal platform to go to keep building on, you know, what are some other things that you have geared up for this year and into the future? 

00:13:23:24 – 00:13:52:19

Dr. Leemon Baird: Okay. So, we have features being added to the platform itself, like the consensus service, the token service we have others that we’ere going to be building on top of that to make the platform more powerful. Now, of course, you can do anything in the consensus in an app net using the consensus service, but we’re going to make it easy to do. So, we’ll add more and more features to Hedera itself. And the community is involved with the Hedera improvement process, the Hedera improvement proposal process, the process where people can make suggestions and then talk about them and come to a conclusion. 

00:13:52:21 – 00:14:17:21

Dr. Leemon Baird: And then, we have, you know, they’re officially blessed and approved by that group. If it’s a change to the code of Hedera itself, even the council will approve it. And we’ve actually done this now. So, I love that the community is involved in this. In addition, we are bringing in more council members. And so, we have council members. We have 21 different council members. The most recent one was Chainlink, which was very exciting.

00:14:17:23 – 00:14:18:08

Richard Carthon: Yeah.

00:14:18:10 – 00:14:44:24

Dr. Leemon Baird: You know, In the Blockchain world, everybody knows who they are. They do Oracle services. And so, it’s very exciting to have them part of the council. And I didn’t even mention what the council is. Hedera is jointly owned by a bunch of independent organizations that are huge, spread around the world in different countries, under different governments, in different jurisdictions, in different markets. And they’re huge companies that would not be easy to bribe, and would not want to hurt their reputation. 

00:14:45:01 – 00:15:06:24

Dr. Leemon Baird: And so, we have Google and IBM and LG Electronics and we have DLA Piper, one of the world’s largest legal firms, building tokens on us. We have EFTPOS, a household name in Australia doing, what are they doing? Payments. So, you go to the store and you pay with EFTPOS. It is just a a common word. Everybody knows the word EFTPOS. That’s how you pay there. 

00:15:07:06 – 00:15:07:21

Richard Carthon: Wow.

00:15:07:23 – 00:15:33:18

Dr. Leemon Baird: We have the biggest bank in Africa, Standard Bank, and we have the oldest bank in South Korea, Shinheung Bank. We have the largest financial institution, one of the largest ones in Japan. We have all sorts of people, Nomura. We have all sorts of people that are council members and 21 growing rapidly. So, we’re going to see in the near future more big names. There will be names you recognize, there’ll be names in more communities and so on. 

00:15:34:07 – 00:16:00:06

Dr. Leemon Baird: What’s the third thing we’ll be doing in the future? More people building on top of us. This is our central focus is building something that’s going to be around for a hundred years that has lots of people using it. At the moment, where the most used ledger in the world, but what we want is even more things. So, we want to be used in a lot of different areas, like there’s people building carbon credit trading markets on top of us and electricity trading markets on top of us. 

00:16:00:15 – 00:16:37:04

Dr. Leemon Baird: So, if you have a solar panel in your house, you want to sell power back to the grid, they can do a market in the electricity. And then, once you’ve tokenized carbon credits and you tokenized electricity, guess what you can do? You can start doing clever things like tokenize the combination of the two. And so, you can buy and sell them together and in real time, you could be buying a kilowatt hour every time you need a kilowatt hour and at the same time buying a carbon offset at the same time so that you’re carbon neutral. And so, you know, our ledger itself is very low energy. I saw a published report that said we used one five millionth as much energy per transaction as Bitcoin did.

00:16:37:06 – 00:16:37:21

Richard Carthon: Wow.

00:16:37:23 – 00:16:45:29

Dr. Leemon Baird: One five millionth. So, we’re trying to be green at our layer, but we’re also enabling people to build on top of us. Real applications that are green, that kind of thing. 

00:16:46:25 – 00:17:35:06

Richard Carthon: Well, those are three really great points. One that I’m going to 100 percent bring up is one at the end where you said we’re building for the next 100 years. Something that I bring up continuously on this show is the importance of knowing your time horizon for whatever you’re trying to be a part of. And I always try to tell our listeners for projects that are building for the future that are not going anywhere and are trying to be here, those are the ones you want to put a special asterisk next to, make sure you’re always paying attention to because you’re not going anywhere. You just said we’re building for the next 100 years and the fact that you are already starting to think of creative ways to have more and more companies built on top of you, have more collaborations, have a council that can help point you in different directions, open up more doors for you and like, are building out all of these like, models is incredible. 

00:17:35:11 – 00:18:19:19

Richard Carthon: So, I mean, I’m pretty hyped about it, like I already knew about Hedera hashgraph, I’m even more excited about this now, which is amazing. And that’s why I love these conversations. But thank you for for breaking all of that down. But I mean, extremely exciting stuff on y’all’s horizon. And, you know, just a couple more things that I want to ask and kind of just go in a different direction is just as we look at the greater Crypto, Blockchain space, so, the first decade was a lot of proof of concept proven that, Hey, this market’s here, it’s not going anywhere. And now, we’re, you know, we’re leading on the bell curve, we’re leading the first initial step and we’re kind of going into that next, we’re on that cusp, right? But as we kind of look into this next decade, you know, what are things that you think people should be paying attention to that you have your eyes on? 

00:18:21:21 – 00:18:42:17

Dr. Leemon Baird: I was about to say, yes, this really is getting traction in 2021. You’re seeing the world of ledgers actually grow up in 2021. People are using it for real things. It isn’t just a little tiny game or something, it’s serious games or serious business or serious real world things like telling people in war zones when they’re about to get bombed and getting that information out using Hedera. 

00:18:42:19 – 00:18:43:04

Richard Carthon: Wow.

00:18:43:06 – 00:19:14:14

Dr. Leemon Baird: That’s actually being done right now. All sorts of real world things are happening now. Lots of stuff with coronavirus is being done. So, 2021 is the year, I think, when this whole industry of Blockchains, of ledgers is now starting to do the things in the real world that we’ve been promising for a decade, now they’re happening. But you asked about the next decade. That’s sort of like saying, well, what good is the Internet, what will it affect? Okay. Is the wheel useful? Yeah, I think the wheel is useful. 

00:19:14:29 – 00:19:15:14

Richard Carthon: Right.

00:19:15:16 – 00:19:53:23

Dr. Leemon Baird: I think that ledgers are going to seep into every corner of the world economy and of society. It doesn’t mean that everything is done on a ledger, that would be stupid. You only do a ledger when you need extra trust. It’ll be cheaper to do a single central computer for things where you don’t need trust. There will always be a need for central computers, but ledgers won’t do everything. But they will do part of every single kind of thing we do. Every company will be using ledgers, every person will be using ledgers throughout the day without even knowing it. I mean, like right now, when you use a credit card, half the time it’s going through FIS Rollpay, which is one of our council members. You don’t even know it. 

00:19:54:23 – 00:19:55:08

Richard Carthon: Right.

00:19:55:10 – 00:20:30:23

Dr. Leemon Baird: But it’s going through half the credit card transactions, they’re going through them. Ledgers are going to be the same way. They’re going to be invisible. You won’t even think about them, they’ll be like electricity with, you know, it’s around you, but you don’t really think about it. They’re going to affect the economy in ways by disintermediating, which means more power to the people. You have less power of some central arbiter that gets between the people that want to interact and controls them. They can just interact. So, there’s more power that way. It lowers prices, it lowers costs, it lowers time. If I send you a wire, I have to pay $30 and it takes days to get through, it’s ones and zeros through a wire.

00:20:30:25 – 00:20:31:10

Richard Carthon: Right.

00:20:31:12 – 00:20:52:04

Dr. Leemon Baird: It can go across the planet in a few seconds and in a fraction of a second. What in the world are we talking about with wires taking all that time? Well, with ledgers, it can literally take a few seconds. You can have a stock market that does matching and settling and clearing and everything all within, you know, four seconds. This is the future we’re going to. 

00:20:52:18 – 00:21:10:27

Dr. Leemon Baird: And so, just like what was the Internet useful for? Well, it was useful for every part of society. You don’t do everything with the Internet, but every part of society has the Internet as part of it. And I think that we’re going to see this. I think it’s going to improve everything, making it cheaper and faster and better, also enable new kinds of things you couldn’t do in the past. 

00:21:11:09 – 00:21:37:21

Dr. Leemon Baird: Like Spencer at Calaxy, said Spencer Dinwiddie said he would even use this sort of system to allow his fans to vote on what shoes to wear in the next game. They could actually vote on that. This is the kind of interaction between people you didn’t have in the past. So, over the next decade, we’re going to see serious usages of ledgers in everything. They won’t do everything, they’ll be piece of everything. That’s what we’re going to see. 

00:21:38:09 – 00:22:31:15

Richard Carthon: You know, you are the first person to come on and give that perspective. So everyone, if you’re listening right now, go back, rewind that. I think that’s an extremely well articulated, well thought out way of saying that. Just like Leemon just said, this is not going anywhere. This is also going to be incorporated into our lives. When the Internet first came out, people didn’t think like, Oh, everyone’s gonna be using this thing. Sounds like ledgers are probably, it’s just going to be so enamored in your life you don’t even realize it’s happening. So, thank you for putting that on my horizon. Thanks for putting that on everyone’s who’s listening horizon as well. But as we kind of wrap up, I have two final questions for you. One is, if you could take all the knowledge you have right now and either go back to yourself and impart wisdom of ways that you could have done your business faster or as a newbie in the Crypto, Blockchain space, what are some things that you would teach yourself? 

00:22:32:26 – 00:23:12:14

Dr. Leemon Baird: Well, I’ll give myself a hash graph algorithm. That would be really useful to have had back then. So, as an entrepreneur in general, I think the real key is to find where the real needs are in the world. You can just make a widget one percent better, but if you look at what the world really needs, that’s what you should put your time and effort into, because that’s where you’re going to have it make a difference and make life better for real people. And so, I would say the biggest thing to do is to constantly be looking. There’s lots of fun things to work on, but look at what’s really going to have an impact. What are the needs that the people have that they don’t even know they have? Steve Jobs was just a wizard at that, right? 

00:23:12:16 – 00:23:13:01

Richard Carthon: Right.

00:23:13:03 – 00:23:47:21

Dr. Leemon Baird: He provided things that people wanted that they didn’t know they wanted. This is the kind of thing to be looking for. Look at the things that are really going to have an effect on real people. And I’ll throw in a second one for free, I would also say that there are some real revolutions going on right now. The ledgers are about to change the world, but so is artificial intelligence, so is the Internet of things, so is a number of different things that are going on right now. And ultimately, I’m very optimistic they will ultimately do more good than harm. But in the short term, we all need to be figuring out how to do it in a way that minimizes the harm.

00:23:47:23 – 00:23:48:08

Richard Carthon: Yeah.

00:23:48:10 – 00:24:08:29

Dr. Leemon Baird: We need to make sure that people are being taken care of in the middle of it all. And so, I’d say that’s the second big thing. If I had to say two big things, find where you can really make a difference, something that needs to be done and do that and try to find a way of doing it that’s going to make the world better in the long run, but also help people in the short run and not hurt people in the short run. That’s what I would say. 

00:24:09:12 – 00:24:28:01

Richard Carthon: Yeah. I mean, and that’s the doctor coming out in you. Just do no harm. And I like that a lot of finding a way to do as much good as you can with doing the least amount of harm as possible. So, I definitely appreciate those two sentiments. But as we kind of wrap things up, you know, what is a final thought that you want to leave with all the listeners here today? 

00:24:30:07 – 00:24:55:24

Dr. Leemon Baird: Well, for people who have been on this journey with us, thank you for your support and for being interested in it. For those who aren’t part of us, but are part of the Blockchain community, I think it’s exciting what you’re doing. You are changing the world. And, Hey, look at us, too. You might want to build some things on us, you might find it useful. For people just in general, thank you for watching this. I hope it was somewhat entertaining and I hope it was somewhat enlightening. And I just want to thank you, Richard, for having me on. I really enjoyed it. Thanks. 

00:24:56:09 – 00:25:11:07

Richard Carthon: Of course. Thank you so much for joining us. I know I personally got a lot of out of it, and I’m sure our listeners will as well. But as people want to learn more about you and learn more about Haddara hashgraph, what are some ways that they can connect with both you and learn more about Hedera? 

00:25:13:05 – 00:25:56:11

Dr. Leemon Baird: Oh, yeah. You can go to Hedera.com. H-E-D-E-R-A, Hereda.com. You can see what we’re doing, you can see the community that has STKs and example programs, you can download free software. We have lots of open source stuff, including the auction. When we get the auction in the near future, we’ll be releasing all the source code for that open source. You can get involved. It also has a page where you can get quality software and exchanges that will give you H bars. There’s things about how we run as a company and how the council works, which is interesting. And yeah, there’s lots of ways to get involved, both as a consumer and as a business and as a startup. We give grants to startups as well, all those things. So to Hedera.com and I hope that you’ll join us on this journey. It’s an exciting journey. 

00:25:56:27 – 00:26:04:12

Richard Carthon: Absolutely. So, everyone listen to make sure you go check that out. Dr. Leemon, thank you again for spending some time with us. And of course, for everyone listening, Stay Crypto Current.